Comments on: How good are the new Dune books? http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/ All you can eat sci-fi and fantasy books Sat, 11 Jun 2011 17:55:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Anonymous http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-15385 Anonymous Tue, 25 Jan 2011 16:31:10 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-15385 I second Attila Torkos Comment....anyone who attacks without reading research or whatever is well how do we put it not smart. I second Attila Torkos Comment….anyone who attacks without reading research or whatever is well how do we put it not smart.

]]> By: Attila Torkos http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-13580 Attila Torkos Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:59:52 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-13580 SandRider! "I’ve not read them, won’t read them, and hate them anyway." You have not read them? This is what I call true fanatism! Attack without knowing what you attack... You are stupid. Attila Torkos SandRider!

“I’ve not read them, won’t read them, and hate them anyway.”

You have not read them? This is what I call true fanatism! Attack without knowing what you attack… You are stupid.

Attila Torkos

]]> By: gmc http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-9187 gmc Wed, 28 Jul 2010 20:30:47 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-9187 "I did not aim for the lowest common denominator and “write down” to anyone." FH Standards of excellence exist for a reason. Why would Brian Herbert allow this to happen to his father's legacy? An unfortunate turn of events. The new books have little or nothing to offer someone who is/was/will be a critical reader of the original works. The new books can be used, however as very effective kindling... the only books I allow my young children to draw on, or make paper airplanes from. A valuable lesson as well, since I taught my children that "almost all books are to be held sacred, and literature is to be exalted, but there are exceptions" - with these books I can really show them what to do with the exceptions. “I did not aim for the lowest common denominator and “write down” to anyone.” FH

Standards of excellence exist for a reason. Why would Brian Herbert allow this to happen to his father’s legacy? An unfortunate turn of events. The new books have little or nothing to offer someone who is/was/will be a critical reader of the original works. The new books can be used, however as very effective kindling… the only books I allow my young children to draw on, or make paper airplanes from.

A valuable lesson as well, since I taught my children that “almost all books are to be held sacred, and literature is to be exalted, but there are exceptions” – with these books I can really show them what to do with the exceptions.

]]> By: Renai LeMay http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1089 Renai LeMay Sun, 25 Oct 2009 14:11:40 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1089 Heh good to see the discussion is still ongoing! :) Heh good to see the discussion is still ongoing! :)

]]> By: Bill van Oosten http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1076 Bill van Oosten Sun, 25 Oct 2009 10:53:34 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1076 I agree with SandRider....Dune was the best. I do not understand the whole idea that a writer can be taken out of context...ie put into a whole new one after death....Dune did not die. Never will. I agree with SandRider….Dune was the best. I do not understand the whole idea that a writer can be taken out of context…ie put into a whole new one after death….Dune did not die. Never will.

]]> By: SandChigger http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1070 SandChigger Sun, 25 Oct 2009 00:06:01 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1070 Finally found what I was looking for, in Frank Herbert's introduction to his <em>Eye</em> collection of stories, in which he discusses the Lynch movie: <blockquote><em>Dune</em> is a film addressed to your audio-visual senses in a unique way, forcing you to participate and not just sit there while it is "done to you." A miniseries restoring the out-takes would make this even more apparent. That's how I wrote the novel, wanting you to participate with the best of your own imagination. I did not aim for the lowest common denominator and "write down" to anyone. You and I have a compact and my responsibility is to entertain you as richly as possible, always giving you as much extra as I can. I assume you are intelligent and will enlist your own imagination. You'll see that when you read the <em>Dune</em> excerpt and the other stories in this collection.</blockquote> How different that is from the approach of the current hack who writes under the title <b>DUNE</b>, who assumes that the reader suffers from deficiencies of both memory and intelligence and has no imagination! Finally found what I was looking for, in Frank Herbert’s introduction to his Eye collection of stories, in which he discusses the Lynch movie:

Dune is a film addressed to your audio-visual senses in a unique way, forcing you to participate and not just sit there while it is “done to you.” A miniseries restoring the out-takes would make this even more apparent.

That’s how I wrote the novel, wanting you to participate with the best of your own imagination. I did not aim for the lowest common denominator and “write down” to anyone. You and I have a compact and my responsibility is to entertain you as richly as possible, always giving you as much extra as I can. I assume you are intelligent and will enlist your own imagination. You’ll see that when you read the Dune excerpt and the other stories in this collection.

How different that is from the approach of the current hack who writes under the title DUNE, who assumes that the reader suffers from deficiencies of both memory and intelligence and has no imagination!

]]> By: SandChigger http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1063 SandChigger Sat, 24 Oct 2009 08:40:50 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1063 (No confidence in posting under a more recognizable name, huh? Whatever.) Since you just quote without comment (hmm ... now who does <b>that</b> sound like?), it's difficult to say what you really had in mind, but I think most would agree that this is in keeping with Herbert's statement to the effect that he expects his readers to bring their own imaginations to the task of reading. (I can't find the exact quote at the moment, maybe you have it?) I like to think that he would be quite disgusted with readers today who demand that someone else do all the work and fill in the details (and "gaps"?) for them. And with his two self-proclaimed "biggest fans" who are trying to force their(?) version on the world as his vision. (No confidence in posting under a more recognizable name, huh? Whatever.)

Since you just quote without comment (hmm … now who does that sound like?), it’s difficult to say what you really had in mind, but I think most would agree that this is in keeping with Herbert’s statement to the effect that he expects his readers to bring their own imaginations to the task of reading. (I can’t find the exact quote at the moment, maybe you have it?) I like to think that he would be quite disgusted with readers today who demand that someone else do all the work and fill in the details (and “gaps”?) for them. And with his two self-proclaimed “biggest fans” who are trying to force their(?) version on the world as his vision.

]]> By: frank herbert McNelly Interview http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1050 frank herbert McNelly Interview Fri, 23 Oct 2009 06:56:31 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1050 FH: Now we all have stories that we go on with after we finish reading them. As children, we can remember playing Treasure Island… WM: Or playing Tom Sawyer… FH: Or Tom Sawyer…any of these. We remember playing these. The story stayed with us…the characters and their conflicts, their joys, their play all stayed with us. WM: And it enkindled sparks in our own imagination, so that we were then active in creative play. FH: That’s exactly right! We went on and told the story ourself… WM: Yes. FH: Now, I deliberately did this in “Dune” for that purpose. I want the person to go on and construct for himself all of these marvellous flights of fantasy and imagination. I want him to…you see, you haven’t had the Spacing Guild explained completely…just enough so that you know its existence. Now with lots of people, they’ve got to complete this. FH: Now we all have stories that we go on with after we finish reading them. As children, we can remember playing Treasure Island…
WM: Or playing Tom Sawyer…
FH: Or Tom Sawyer…any of these. We remember playing these. The story stayed with us…the characters and their conflicts, their joys, their play all stayed with us.
WM: And it enkindled sparks in our own imagination, so that we were then active in creative play.
FH: That’s exactly right! We went on and told the story ourself…
WM: Yes.
FH: Now, I deliberately did this in “Dune” for that purpose. I want the person to go on and construct for himself all of these marvellous flights of fantasy and imagination. I want him to…you see, you haven’t had the Spacing Guild explained completely…just enough so that you know its existence. Now with lots of people, they’ve got to complete this.

]]> By: frank herbert McNelly Interview http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-1049 frank herbert McNelly Interview Fri, 23 Oct 2009 06:56:05 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-1049 FH: Now we all have stories that we go on with after we finish reading them. As children, we can remember playing Treasure Island… WM: Or playing Tom Sawyer… FH: Or Tom Sawyer…any of these. We remember playing these. The story stayed with us…the characters and their conflicts, their joys, their play all stayed with us. WM: And it enkindled sparks in our own imagination, so that we were then active in creative play. FH: That’s exactly right! We went on and told the story ourself… WM: Yes. FH: Now we all have stories that we go on with after we finish reading them. As children, we can remember playing Treasure Island…
WM: Or playing Tom Sawyer…
FH: Or Tom Sawyer…any of these. We remember playing these. The story stayed with us…the characters and their conflicts, their joys, their play all stayed with us.
WM: And it enkindled sparks in our own imagination, so that we were then active in creative play.
FH: That’s exactly right! We went on and told the story ourself…
WM: Yes.

]]> By: SandRider http://www.keepingthedoor.com/2009/08/14/how-good-are-the-new-dune-books/#comment-966 SandRider Mon, 19 Oct 2009 03:05:13 +0000 http://www.keepingthedoor.com/?p=294#comment-966 I actually agree with this - and if Frank could have figured out how to wrap up the whole arc of his story in one book, Paul takes the sandtrout skin, sets the Golden Path in motion, &etc, I think he would have. He conceived of the story told in the first three books as one story. God-emperor was an indulgence. The last two were written because he was offered more money than a sane man could refuse. (which is very different from saying "he did it for the money")(That's Brian & Keith) I actually agree with this – and if Frank could have
figured out how to wrap up the whole arc of his story
in one book, Paul takes the sandtrout skin, sets the
Golden Path in motion, &etc, I think he would have.

He conceived of the story told in the first three
books as one story. God-emperor was an indulgence.
The last two were written because he was offered more
money than a sane man could refuse. (which is very
different from saying “he did it for the money”)(That’s
Brian & Keith)

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